Sooo many questions!

Discussion in 'Camper Pre-Purchase Questions' started by nenis, Mar 13, 2018.

  1. nenis

    nenis New Member

    7
    1
    Mar 12, 2018
    S.O.S.!! I am getting a bit overwhelmed and I'm trying to pretend like I know what I'm doing before my hubby calls quits! He finds this to be a hassle.

    We live in Minnesota and will be picking up our unregistered, non-titled pop up in Wisconsin this weekend. I'm a bit nervous about this because the vin number on the pop up is worn out and hard to read.

    Everything I read online becomes more contradicting and confusing. I called DVS and spoke to the same lady who helped me in person. She didnt seem like she knows what shes talking about. She says all I need is a bill of sale.

    Below is a list of questions. I really appreciate any help you can provide me. Keep in mind that I REALLY want this pup. Its a 91 Rockwood in super great shape for an even more affordable price!

    1) Using a flashlight I managed to read 17 VIN numbers imprinted on the pup. Where can I verify if these numbers are correct?
    b.) What if the numbers I'm seeing are incorrect?

    2)On the DVS website, it states that I need pictures, the attendant in the DVS only said i need a Bill of Sale. Should I acquire anything else? https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/dvs/pages/dvs-content-detail.aspx?pageID=638

    3) Is a pop up qualified as a trailer (it says so on the plate) or a recreational vehicle?

    4) Do I need to insure it? If so, do I ensure it as as a trailer or rv?

    5) Will the Bill of Sale be enough for bringing the pup into MN? Incase I get pulled over.

    Thanks for any feedback you can provide
    Thanks!
    Irene
     
  2. Halford

    Halford Well-Known Member

    2,982
    275
    Sep 28, 2011
    Santa Clarita, California
    Not sure... every state has different laws. Other MN members may answer your million questions... ;D
     
  3. nenis

    nenis New Member

    7
    1
    Mar 12, 2018
    lol! I'm very thorough!
     
  4. DJS12354

    DJS12354 Well-Known Member

    Your bullet 3 says Plate on trailer. Did you try backtracking from the plate number? Just a thought.
     
  5. nenis

    nenis New Member

    7
    1
    Mar 12, 2018
    The plate Im referring to is the sticker plate on the side of the pup. It does not have the vehicle plates or a tittle or registration.
     
  6. jnc

    jnc Welcome from New Hampshire

    I mite try to get a plate for a homemade trailer just to get it home if you cant get a good vin reading does the seller have an old registration this would help with reading the vin.
     
  7. terry1419

    terry1419 Active Member

    650
    65
    Mar 6, 2016
    Streator, IL
    First of all, welcome to the Portal. Secondly, calm down and relax.
    I'm sure the 17 numbers you mention is the VIN. That's exactly WHERE you verify the vehicle number when checking a title and/or bill of sale.
    As Halford said, every state has different laws so you need to ask your department of Motor Vehicles (or whoever issues plates and registration).
    Terminology is all over the place. Some call motorhomes and 5th wheels as RV's.
    You probably need to insure it, if for no other reason than to have it covered for liability. If the cost for the Pup was low, you may not care to have it insured for damage. Mine is covered by my HO policy when at home and by my vehicle insurance when being towed. Check with your insurance company(ies) for guidance.
    Will the Bill of Sale be enough to get it home? Probably. Just don't get stopped by a new trooper who is trying to show his superior that he is doing a great job! Make sure the lights and turn signals work and don't speed.
    Good luck with everything.
     
    Orchid likes this.
  8. nenis

    nenis New Member

    7
    1
    Mar 12, 2018
    The previous owner has absolutely nothing for it! I will check this out. Thanks
     
  9. BikeNFish

    BikeNFish Well-Known Member

    1,186
    683
    Apr 24, 2017
    Maplewood, MN
    I bought my pup in Wisconsin and titled it in Minnesota.

    You definitely need a bill of sale. I used this:
     

    Attached Files:

  10. giadiep

    giadiep Active Member

    333
    131
    Sep 5, 2015
    Syracuse, NY
    Just to clear up the insurance question:

    If you do not separately insure the popup, then your homeowners insurance covers it for liability when at home, and your auto policy covers it for liability when you are towing.

    Neither offers coverage for the value of the popup itself (there are some homeowners policies that throw in a small limit for trailers, but is usually less than $1000).

    This is true 99% of the time regardless of what US state you live in. However, you should check with your insurance agent.

    In NY, you need a bill of sale (could be written on any form of paper as long as it is signed and dated by the seller) and a title with a vin number. If there is no title or vin number, you have to register it as homemade. It’s a pain.
     
    theseus likes this.
  11. nenis

    nenis New Member

    7
    1
    Mar 12, 2018
    Thank you for clarifying the insurance question.
     
  12. nenis

    nenis New Member

    7
    1
    Mar 12, 2018
    Printing this out! thanks you
     
  13. Dback2k4

    Dback2k4 Active Member

    283
    108
    Jul 16, 2017
    Iowa
    I agree, RELAX. Campers are supposed to be fun! :)

    Your auto insurance will typically cover you for liability while towing (no coverage of your camper itself, just the liability - you may also not have coverage for damage done to your vehicle by your camper). Your homeowners may or may not give you any protection, usually not. I have a full coverage policy on my old pup that costs me about $10/month so well worth it in my opinion. Call your agent just to be safe.

    Some states will offer a cheap 1- or 3-day "temporary" plate you can print-at-home for a trailer or vehicle you're purchasing. Might be worth checking into, both from Wisconsin or Minnesota, either will get the thing home for you. (See Wisconsin's rules here.) Otherwise if you have the bill of sale dated the same date and get stopped, a Trooper may let you go, YMMV. Definitely make sure the lights work or wire up some temporary lights before heading out. If you get stopped with no plates and no working lights, you're asking for trouble.

    My pup had a full title when I bought it so transferring was easy. Bring your bill of sale to your local DMV. They might have to fetch a supervisor, but they'll know how to handle. Having a picture or written down copy of the VIN plate will help. Be prepared to pay sales tax. Also know the pup's square footage. In Iowa, all RVs plate fees based on square footage, again I have no idea how MN will handle. They will likely issue you an RV plate, and not a generic trailer plate.
     
    nenis likes this.
  14. BikeNFish

    BikeNFish Well-Known Member

    1,186
    683
    Apr 24, 2017
    Maplewood, MN
    I just spoke with a coworker (also a Portal member - J Starksy) that just so happens to have formerly worked at a Deputy Registrars office in his earlier life.

    Bottom line, it will be a bit of a pain to title that pup in Minnesota. Your should call the Wisconsin DMV or go online to find out from them what you need to do there before you can title it here in Minnesota. HERE is another thread on the Portal that may help you understand your situation.

    There are 17 digits in a title. You may have to call Wisconsin to verify these numbers.
    The way J Starsky explained it, if a trailer contains the "four basic systems of life", shelter, power, water and heat, it is considered a recreational trailer and must be titled as an RV. If it is missing any of the four, it is a utility trailer and can be titled as such.
    I don't believe that you MUST insure a pup in Minnesota. You should ask your insurance agent.
    I spoke to a good friend of mine that is a Washington (MN) County Deputy Sheriff and he said that the bill of sale is enough to cover you while transporting back to Minnesota.

    Sorry, no answer for you on #2, but the red text link above may hold some clues on which direction to go.

    I hope my answers help.

    Good luck!
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2018
    nenis likes this.
  15. giadiep

    giadiep Active Member

    333
    131
    Sep 5, 2015
    Syracuse, NY
    On another note, your husband will get over his frustration/fear whatever he may be feeling. A few years ago, my wife wanted a popup, so we bought a used one. I then realized that the one we bought was big and would be a challenge to tow with our minivan. So I saw the opportunity to upgrade to a nicer suv, but we also had to buy all the crap I needed to get for the camper and the brake controller. But we enjoyed it for a few years so it was worth it. Then we both wanted a hybrid. So sell the popup, buy the hybrid and a full size pickup (I’m a car guy so I made lemonade). And we camped even more. Our kids love it and we spend more quality time together. So no matter the headaches or cost, it has been a good adventure for our family. Just show your husband testimonials like this and he’ll see past the work and expense.
     
  16. kcsa75

    kcsa75 Well-Known Member

    1,371
    438
    Sep 9, 2013
    Kansas City
    Edited
     
  17. Ladiesman

    Ladiesman Active Member

    111
    26
    Feb 6, 2018
    On my 1992 Rockwood the Vin is also stamped into the tongue on The right side if standing in front of the camper looking back. Its pretty good sized stampings. If you look hard i guarntee you will see it. Its on the top of the rail.
     
    nenis likes this.
  18. J Starsky

    J Starsky Active Member

    415
    229
    Aug 3, 2017
    East Central MN
    I'll confirm these are my thoughts. I used to be a manager at a deputy office, high volume at that, and you would see odd stuff. That "four systems" of life is where school busses turned campers always hit a snag. They'd never hang a water system inside them and cannot be an RV, making them get commercial weight limit plates which is an entirely different pricing schedule than the RV class. $$$$

    Just because someone in WI feels they don't need a title does not mean MN will not REQUIRE a title. WI has small trailer rules unlike MN, and you must read the code in WI to figure out what is required - you might get different opinions from counter staff, but you need to know the rules before they do. Personally, I'd do your deal in a WI title office parking lot, firstly going inside to verify you potential transfer problems. You don't want to be 5 years away from today, in a car accident, towing a trailer and a janky title situation. You will lose all day. Bonded title status is not where you want to be on a popup, either.

    Sounds like you're picking it up today regardless, and don't let me talk you out of it. I hope things go positive for you folks!
     
    BikeNFish likes this.
  19. MNTCamper

    MNTCamper Active Member

    601
    65
    Jun 14, 2014
    In MN, a pop up is a titled trailer and needs plates and yearly tags. The tags are $14 / year, so no big deal. You can't tag it as a utility trailer (less than 3K lbs) which is lifetime permanent tags and no yearly fee. The tags are renewed at the end of Feb each year. It is possible that you may be able to title it in MN with the bill of sale and the VIN - it would be easier if you had a title to transfer. I purchased my pop up over in WI also (Roberts) and I just towed it back and stopped down at the license place a few days later - it was not a big deal. You may need to pay sales tax, mine was less than 10 years old, but you don't with older cars, so maybe not with an older pop up.

    Insurance is up to you in regards to comprehensive coverage, liability when towing comes along with the vehicle.
     
    nenis likes this.
  20. nenis

    nenis New Member

    7
    1
    Mar 12, 2018



    You are amazing!!! Thank you so much! I cant wait to get!
     
    BikeNFish likes this.

Share This Page