Hot Water Tank vs Tankless Water Heater

[dcornelius]

My used pop-up (a 2002 Coleman Niagara purchased last summer) came with a built-in hot water tank. When we checked everything out, I'm pretty sure it was working (don't recall exactly now) but hasn't when I've been camping--nothing I've tried produces any kind of warm water in the sink. I've watched a couple of YouTube videos and tried inspecting it but am pretty sure I'll have to take it in to get serviced--it probably needs a new anode rod and maybe more. Admittedly, I haven't spent that much time looking at it yet.

So before I proceed with that, I wanted to ask for opinions on replacing it with a tankless one. It would save a little weight and some space in the storage compartment and I think (correct me if I'm wrong) there would be less maintenance (no need to drain and winterize).

Are they worth it? I've seen them priced anywhere from $200 - $600, are there some brands to stay away from?

The ones I've seen at CampingWorld.com are portable; from video product I've seen, they say it's easy set up--just 15 minutes! But I don't want to take it out of the storage compartment, hang it somewhere, and hook the hoses up every time I go camping; I want this permanently mounted like the current one is, and just be able to use it. I'm sure that's doable.

I've also seen both electric and propane--my camper has both.

Is this feasible? Pros/Cons?

 

[kitphantom]

For the original water heater - does it run at all, making sure you have water in it? If so, is there a by-passs for winterization in winter mode? That can keep hot water from reaching the sink.

 

[Dnodoz]

We recently replaced our 6 gal Suburban water heater that was constantly giving us trouble with a Fogatti tankless water heater. It was designed to slide into the same space the Suburban came out of. It was about $400 plus the cost of some brass fittings and a pressure relief valve.

Been out on two weekly camp outs this spring and absolutely love it. Only used propane when water faucet is open. Supposed to use about 20% less propane.

We replaced the control board on the Suburban twice in 2 years. When it came time to replace again we said that’s enough.

 

[Sjm9911]

Your 2002 water heater probably dosent have a controll board, and yea, you will need to winterize it or the new one, or make sure there is no water in them. Before I spent money on something else, I would learn how to use the one I had. Eaither way you need to learn something new? Probably needs cleaning and a new thermocouple. The anoid rods should be changed when bad also, its easy. If maintaining this is scarry , get rid of the camper. There are much worse maintance issues to deal with. And the weight, when empty isnt a lot. So you really will not be saving any weight. TBH, even full its negligible.

 

[dcornelius]

For the original water heater - does it run at all, making sure you have water in it? If so, is there a by-passs for winterization in winter mode? That can keep hot water from reaching the sink.

I could run water through it but it never got warm. After watching a video, I realized I needed to lite a pilot light (DOH!) but it never would that I could tell. The propane stove inside worked so I know I had propane through the system, just not sure how to get the water heater going. I let water run in the sink with the hot water handle open until it stopped to let as much water out of the tank as I could last November after my last fall trip. I don't remember seeing any kind of winterization by-pass.

We recently replaced our 6 gal Suburban water heater that was constantly giving us trouble with a Fogatti tankless water heater. It was designed to slide into the same space the Suburban came out of. It was about $400 plus the cost of some brass fittings and a pressure relief valve.

Been out on two weekly camp outs this spring and absolutely love it. Only used propane when water faucet is open. Supposed to use about 20% less propane.

We replaced the control board on the Suburban twice in 2 years. When it came time to replace again we said that’s enough.

So replacing a control board happens that frequently? A drop-in replacement sounds nice.

Your 2002 water heater probably dosent have a controll board, and yea, you will need to winterize it or the new one, or make sure there is no water in them. Before I spent money on something else, I would learn how to use the one I had. Eaither way you need to learn something new? Probably needs cleaning and a new thermocouple. The anoid rods should be changed when bad also, its easy. If maintaining this is scarry , get rid of the camper. There are much worse maintance issues to deal with. And the weight, when empty isnt a lot. So you really will not be saving any weight. TBH, even full its negligible.

Oh, so maybe I won't have Dnodoz's problem--good advice to learn about the one I have now. I have lots of terminology to get familiar with. The mix of electric and propane and learning how to troubleshoot does seem a little daunting but if I'm out in the wilderness, I definitely need to have these skills.

Thanks!

 

[Sjm9911]

Manual for the xamper for some basic stuff is here

Owners Manuals

Here is a collection of owner's manuals for Coleman and Fleetwood pop ups. They help with general setup, operation, and towing of the camper. Parts books can be found here 1968 All Models 1983 All Models 1984 Pioneer and Americana 1985 Colorado Plantation 1988...

colemanpopupparts.com

And lighting the pilot light on the water heater takes some time. We can walk you through it.

 

[Sjm9911]

And the bypass is on the rear of the heater itself. So, you need to follow the water lines on the rear of the heater. You may have eaither, a valve bypass that you just turn a few valves to bypass the heater. Or a manual one , that you have to unscrew and attach. If eaither of these are on for winterazation, you will only get cold water in your system.

 

[bluespruce]

I find getting the pilot light lit takes a long time (a few minutes) on ours and it was the same with the previous model. Eventually the gas gets there and it lights but seems like it takes forever and I would have given up earlier if I didn’t know I was doing it right. I.e. patience is necessary when lighting it.

I usually hear a rush of water filling the tank when I close the bypass valve and have the other valves open.

Water heaters are finicky but rarely used by some so it could be in good shape. I wouldn’t give up on it yet because it could be just fine.

 

[jmkay1]

If your water heater is in the trunk I’m assuming the bypass valves are where mine are at. To access the bypass valves you will need to bend back the plastic (it’s velcred) inside The trunk directly behind the tank. The Velcro is actually pretty good stuff so it may take some force. Once in you will need to Turn a couple knobs to direct the water back to the tank assuming it was previously bypassed during winterization. Before you attempt to light you need to make sure water is getting in the tank. However before you fill i would replace the anodes rod otherwise you will be wearing all that water. check the manual for the size you need to buy. With all that said I never bothered getting mine to light because all I really need it for is the sink but I cook and clean outside so I just boil water. Good luck.

 

[Sjm9911]

If your water heater is in the trunk I’m assuming the bypass valves are where mine are at. To access the bypass valves you will need to bend back the plastic (it’s velcred) inside The trunk directly behind the tank. The Velcro is actually pretty good stuff so it may take some force. Once in you will need to Turn a couple knobs to direct the water back to the tank assuming it was previously bypassed during winterization. Before you attempt to light you need to make sure water is getting in the tank. However before you fill i would replace the anodes rod otherwise you will be wearing all that water. check the manual for the size you need to buy. With all that said I never bothered getting mine to light because all I really need it for is the sink but I cook and clean outside so I just boil water. Good luck.

Not all the Coleman ones had valves for a bypass. Mine , a year older , had a tube you had to manually put in line. So, you unscrewed the cold intake and the hot output, and screwed them on a straight tube. This was the maual bypass.

 

[Ccctucker]

My used pop-up (a 2002 Coleman Niagara purchased last summer) came with a built-in hot water tank. When we checked everything out, I'm pretty sure it was working (don't recall exactly now) but hasn't when I've been camping--nothing I've tried produces any kind of warm water in the sink. I've watched a couple of YouTube videos and tried inspecting it but am pretty sure I'll have to take it in to get serviced--it probably needs a new anode rod and maybe more. Admittedly, I haven't spent that much time looking at it yet.

So before I proceed with that, I wanted to ask for opinions on replacing it with a tankless one. It would save a little weight and some space in the storage compartment and I think (correct me if I'm wrong) there would be less maintenance (no need to drain and winterize).

Are they worth it? I've seen them priced anywhere from $200 - $600, are there some brands to stay away from?

The ones I've seen at CampingWorld.com are portable; from video product I've seen, they say it's easy set up--just 15 minutes! But I don't want to take it out of the storage compartment, hang it somewhere, and hook the hoses up every time I go camping; I want this permanently mounted like the current one is, and just be able to use it. I'm sure that's doable.

I've also seen both electric and propane--my camper has both.

Is this feasible? Pros/Cons?

I think the most important info is how much you use it? If it’s just for dishes, I just heat water in a metal pot for when I need it. We use a hot water bag that is heated by the sun for hand and body washing. My pop up was small and basic and we only spent time inside when the weather was bad

 

[Sjm9911]

I liked my water heater in the pup and the TT now. In the pup, I turned it on at dinner time, so hot water for showers and washing. I learned that it didnt use that much gas and started keeping it on for the whole trip shortly after that.

 

[Dnodoz]

I think the most important info is how much you use it? If it’s just for dishes, I just heat water in a metal pot for when I need it. We use a hot water bag that is heated by the sun for hand and body washing. My pop up was small and basic and we only spent time inside when the weather was bad

When we were raising the kids we camped like you including tent camping. Now that we’re retired I have to say we’ve turned into glampers. We’ve got every convenience we could need crammed into a 12’ box popup. We would have gone to the dark side if we had a place to store it but our popup is in the garage.

I saw the tankless water heater we put in this winter has gone up in price 25% on Amazon. Even I would rethink replacing at these prices. Our control boards must have getting burned by a short somewhere in the wiring. Our simple solution was bypass all of the oem wiring and replace our water heater with an expensive but very easy to install on demand. Definitely not everyone’s solution!

 

[kitphantom]

We like having a HWT tank far more than we imagined we would, even though we don't use the shower. We can revert to heating water on the stove when necessary, such as when we drained the lines when a very-early snowstorm hit last Oct.

 

[Aggiebq86]

There are a few things that will prevent a pilot light from lighting that are easy to address. First is insects. Clean out any bugs, nests and debris that is accumulated around the pilot and burner. Make sure to check the orifice tube as well. Next is just purging the gas line to make sure you have propane to the water heater. This can take a couple of minutes to do. Hold the pilot button down while holding a long handled lighter at the pilot. It helps if you have already purged the line to the stove. Next is the thermocouple. This is the small metal cylinder on the end of a tiny copper tube that is next to the pilot light. You may have seen one on a gas heater, stove or water heater before. This is a fail safe mechanism that prevents gas from flowing if the pilot light isn't lit. It is easy to replace and parts can be found at any big box home improvement store. If the thermcouple is bad, the pilot will light while holding down the pilot light button, but it won't stay lit when you release it. If the pilot is lighting but not staying lit, Try holding down the pilot button for about a minut to give the flame time to warm up the thermocouple. If it fails to stay lit when the button is released, the thermocouple is bad. Very easy to replace.

One final note, it can be difficult to see that the pilot light is actually lit. rotate the knob from "pilot" to "on" and the burner should fire up in a second or so.

 

[dcornelius]

Wow! Thank you all for your suggestions and help!

It's raining today (and even mixed with snow--rare for April in NW Oregon) so I won't be opening it up and doing any troubleshooting today but I am posting a picture that I took a few months back when I opened the front storage compartment in December and found a lot of condensation. (I have since added some Dri-Z-Air dehumidifier crystals which have helped a lot.) Anyway, the circled area on the picture is where the water tank is and when things dry up here, I'll open it up and try to get that pilot light lit. I'll also go get a special tool to take the anode rod out so I can check it.

About my need for hot water? Most of the time, I don't need it. Yes, I've heated water on the stove for washing dishes and so far, I've stayed only at parks where there are warm showers. The main reason I'd like to have hot water is because I don't like to have broken equipment or answer questions like "why are there two handles on your sink faucet but all you get is cold water?" LOL! Besides, I want to try boondocking (as soon as I figure out the electrical stuff) and want to be able to use the outside water hose for showering. I'm sure I'll appreciate the convenience once it's working.

After trying to get it going and not having any success, I thought it might be better to replace it with a tankless one--you know, newer technology, less weight, more storage area... But with the weight being negligible, the price of TWHs going up, and reading how "easy" it might be to fix what I have (it might not even be broken!), now I'm thinking I can actually do this myself for just a little more time and a lot less money than I thought. I do remember seeing it was fairly clean (no insects or nests) but looked old. I just need to learn about the thermocouple and whether it has a by-pass valve. I don't know why I didn't look for the manual (thanks for the link!) but now I have that, too!

Thanks again, everyone! I'll start a different topic if I have have problems getting it going.

 

[Mitchell Porter]

I'm getting ready to put an insta-hot in. My pup only has a single push button faucet, gonna take it out and put a small vanity faucet in. Then it's just plumbing to figure.out.

 

[Barbara Gilbert]

My used pop-up (a 2002 Coleman Niagara purchased last summer) came with a built-in hot water tank. When we checked everything out, I'm pretty sure it was working (don't recall exactly now) but hasn't when I've been camping--nothing I've tried produces any kind of warm water in the sink. I've watched a couple of YouTube videos and tried inspecting it but am pretty sure I'll have to take it in to get serviced--it probably needs a new anode rod and maybe more. Admittedly, I haven't spent that much time looking at it yet.

So before I proceed with that, I wanted to ask for opinions on replacing it with a tankless one. It would save a little weight and some space in the storage compartment and I think (correct me if I'm wrong) there would be less maintenance (no need to drain and winterize).

Are they worth it? I've seen them priced anywhere from $200 - $600, are there some brands to stay away from?

The ones I've seen at CampingWorld.com are portable; from video product I've seen, they say it's easy set up--just 15 minutes! But I don't want to take it out of the storage compartment, hang it somewhere, and hook the hoses up every time I go camping; I want this permanently mounted like the current one is, and just be able to use it. I'm sure that's doable.

I've also seen both electric and propane--my camper has both.

Is this feasible? Pros/Cons?

I am not sure this would apply to a tankless water heater in a popup but just in case, a little information can't hurt. We installed a tankless water heater in the wash stall in our barn. We did not even think about winterizing it. We had some unusually cold weather and the tankless water heater froze inside the barn and the internal plumbing (which had water in it even though there was no storage tank) burst, completely ruining the unit. So if you decide to go that way, be sure to check out the requirement. It might still need to be drained for cold weather storage.

 

[Dnodoz]

Our unit allows for anti-freeze the be run through it just like the water pump. If you are camping and get cold weather, it has a setting to keep the unit from freezing.

 

[bw1974]

My used pop-up (a 2002 Coleman Niagara purchased last summer) came with a built-in hot water tank. When we checked everything out, I'm pretty sure it was working (don't recall exactly now) but hasn't when I've been camping--nothing I've tried produces any kind of warm water in the sink. I've watched a couple of YouTube videos and tried inspecting it but am pretty sure I'll have to take it in to get serviced--it probably needs a new anode rod and maybe more. Admittedly, I haven't spent that much time looking at it yet.

So before I proceed with that, I wanted to ask for opinions on replacing it with a tankless one. It would save a little weight and some space in the storage compartment and I think (correct me if I'm wrong) there would be less maintenance (no need to drain and winterize).

Are they worth it? I've seen them priced anywhere from $200 - $600, are there some brands to stay away from?

The ones I've seen at CampingWorld.com are portable; from video product I've seen, they say it's easy set up--just 15 minutes! But I don't want to take it out of the storage compartment, hang it somewhere, and hook the hoses up every time I go camping; I want this permanently mounted like the current one is, and just be able to use it. I'm sure that's doable.

I've also seen both electric and propane--my camper has both.

Is this feasible? Pros/Cons?

I down-sized from a 2003 Utah to a 2000 SeaPine which doesn't have a water pump or water heater. I ended up getting a Hike Crew instant water heater. It sets up within 5mins and it is almost instant with the hot water. I use it on my elk hunting trips in the top of the rocky mountains of CO. I purchased a 55gal drum for water and just drop the feed line into it, then hang the spray wand in my pup-up shower tent next to the tongue end of the camper so I can hook it directly to 1 of the 2 propane tanks. I ordered it on Amazon $280 ()